The Men Who Fought and Fulfilled America

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0:00 I think we left off at the alien and sedicious acts if I'm correct. Uh part of that omnibus package is really popular today. Uh the aliens exclusion act. We can it's part of the omnus package here. We can talk about that later. I'm not going to talk about that so much now. Uh but it was a curtailment obviously of the first amendment uh allowing for imprisonment of peoples who spoke out particularly Democratic Republicans who spoke out against the Adams administration. Um I want to jump back just very quickly again on these different idea perceived ideas of the role of the executive branch that these different groups had as well. Adams when titles were being considered for the president uh wanted the president to be called his excellency or his majesty. again very much in the vein of a monarch. Uh very much believed in a strong uni uni unit un unitary executive branch which is actually quite popular in conservative movements today. Um so he very much believed in that. Adams and Jefferson laughed about it uh especially

1:06 because they knew he had aims to be president and they're like you're just some dude from Brainree. What are you doing man? Uh and we're all kind of backwater of the British Empire anyways. What are we all doing? Uh, and that there is a Joe reminded me of this and I I wanted to talk about a little bit um about the Declaration of Independence just very briefly. Um I think it's one of the most beautiful and eloquent things written. Um I don't have it memorized unlike some people here. Um you know obviously primarily authored by Thomas Jefferson who was its main editor and the person who added the most to it aside from Jefferson was John Adams. Um, Adams did inherently believe in unalienable rights that applied to all peoples. Uh, and Madison and Jefferson kind of threw that back in his face when he talked about his excellency or his majesty. He said, "The president shits the same way we do. Uh, the king shits the same way we do. We are all equal before the law." And that's why and I talked about this a little bit uh in my

2:08 last uh talk but that's why this idea of impeachment became so powerful to impeach the king the executive obviously this all started back in Magna Carta but this was a very powerful idea of a curtailment and a check and checks and balances system to keep the government from being too oppressive even within itself. There's sort of a dual dichotomy. 10th amendment gives all powers not granted here into the states. Um and that's one balancing act. State sovereignty versus the limited uh constitution you know the first second and third articles that limit actually what role each branch can play. Uh the supreme court might be the uh interpretation of the constitution when a law is passed but they can only see cases in controversy. They can't just opine about what whether or not a new law is constitutional or not. A case has to be brought up through the system from a trial court to the Supreme Court and only then can they rule on it and it has to be a case they can actually see has to have what's called standing. Someone

3:11 has to actually have been injured by it. So the Supreme Court might be the final interpretation of the Constitution, but it has to get there and they have a very narrow lane. Congress makes those laws. It's supposed to make them constitutional. We can debate whether or not they always do. um and number of times it gets struck down, but they're supposed to do that and the president is supposed to execute those laws. That's what those agencies of alphabet soups are for. So when we pass the Alien Sedicious Act, which is unconstitutional, uh you have somebody like the FBI or CIA or whomever enforcing that act. That's where these agencies come from is to enforce the President's Act. A problem we'll talk about later which the founders did not anticipate was agencies making their own laws. Uh what's called rulemaking um where ATF and FBI now have different laws and enforce them differently and they say it's within congressional scope. This is some of my own works that I go off on a tangent on. I won't talk about those

4:13 now. Uh but there's a lot of criticism of uh rulem in general that these agencies have. Um but so these acts are passed and uh Adams obviously uses it. He remember he helped write the declaration of independence adopts the constitution uh does not believe in really religious diversity or diversity of thought uh at all. He's a little more lenient on diversity of peoples. Um and he happens to get Jefferson's friend who becomes the he's the who happens to just be the biggest newspaper writer for the Democratic Republicans in jail. Uh so oops and yeah so that's one of Adam's big thing and later uh Jefferson will become president. His very first act is actually to repeal the alien seditions act. Um but now I want to jump to Madison. Madison is working as secretary of state for Jefferson when he's president.

5:13 Thomas Jefferson is our third president of the United States and Madison is actually somehow figures out about the about Napoleon's and really Talan's Talan is the foreign minister for the French probably one of the most brilliant people of that time uh crazy man absolutely crazy man power- hungry fiend uh he kept he loved Mackie uh kept keep a copy and he really he really believed in it and he was very successful also came from almost nothing uh to end up being Napoleon's really left-hand man uh and a lot of things and Madison finds out through the grapevine and through tally rand through bribes that the French are uh bankrupt entirely uh the French don't have their own centralized bank uh and they're entirely bankrupt and they've been taking out loans from the Vatican uh and from other the everybody's taking money from the Dutch at this time. Uh the Dutch are the financiers of Europe for the most part.

6:18 The French can't take out any money from the British for obvious reasons. Uh and Madison thinks, well, this might be an opportunity. And he goes to Jefferson. They have no money and they have all this land and they control the port rights to one of the most important ports in the United States, uh New Orleans. And they also have all this other territory. We don't really care as much about that. we really care about West Florida is what it's called at the time. Uh but maybe we can get a good deal. Uh and so Jefferson and Napoleon engage in these talks really through Telly Random Madison and we end up in probably the best purchase of all time uh for almost no money for millions of acres of land, fertile land, important trade land, all because the French are bankrupt. um not through any like really big ingenious uh and actually we were talking about uh before gossip about what the founders would throw at each other. Uh Madison and Jefferson really found part of this through Talan's gossip. Um so they're

7:24 able to do one of the greatest purchases of all time expanding the United States. Many of you will later know the Monroe Doctrine about settling the rest of the United States. Uh but it's a very interesting to see the correspondence between Madison and Jefferson at this time. Uh they believed what they were doing was unconstitutional. Uh they did not have the power to do this. Uh and they were absolutely right. They did not have the power to do this. But they did it anyways. And Congress was none the wiser. Uh the Supreme Court did not really seem to care very much about this and we ended up getting doubling the size of the United States for not that much money. Uh money that we partially borrowed from the Dutch and it was pretty pretty amazing. Uh unconstitutional as hell. Um and that it's very interesting if you read

8:26 Madison's own diaries about it. He tosses and turn. He's the architect of the constitution. Uh and it happens to be flexible when it needs to be for him. Uh it's sort of a moral of many presidents uh who pass through uh Pennsylvania Avenue. Uh so Madison next becomes our president. Madison has to do a lot of lobbying. Uh he's the dwarf man. He's not as compelling or as attractive of a figure as Thomas Jefferson. Um, you know, there is a little bit of a Madison did uh fight in the war. Uh, he was really more of a secretary, but much like Hamilton, but he did fight. Um, you have to remember that Adams and Jefferson were sort of lamblasted for their not fighting. when Jefferson unfairly is maligned as giving up uh Virginia when he's governor during the

9:28 revolution. Um Adams does not uh he's obviously serves in Congress um and is a very prominent figure. Madison is able to use this idea that he's a vet to help get him into office. He's able to get the Virginia bourgeoa behind him and he's able to convince New York and Pennsylvania who are the most important uh swing states. I mean them along with Virginia are the most important states. And so Madison comes into power and he actually comes in he rides a bit high because of the Louisiana purchase because of the success of Thomas Jefferson. Um what Madison does not realize when he gets in and him and Jefferson neglected this was relations with Britain. Um many of you probably know the War of 1812. Um we are really uh taken by surprise about how powerful the Canadian British forces are and how shittily we do against them. They end up burning down the original White House and destru destroying DC. Um and they joke about it. A lot of critiques

10:35 um of Madison is so you've made yourself out to be a veteran and then you lost the capital to the British who burned it down. Um like so much uh so much for that uh war experience that you have. Um and it that actually lives with Madison the rest of his life and sting it's a particularly stinkful memory for him that he'll write about in his diaries. So Madison at the end, you know, Jefferson fights the the Burberry Pirates a little bit, but Madison after this, I won't say defeat, but we'll call it a pretty damn close to defeat draw with the British. Remember, Jackson wins New Orleans after the war is over. Um, we had already signed unfavorable terms. Um, had there been, and this is no fault of Madison by any means, but had he waited until Jackson had a resounding victory in New Orleans, we probably would have been a

11:35 real draw or pretty close to a victory. Um, but he didn't, and we signed on favorable terms. Um, and Madison began a moving more toward a centralized power. Madison was a democratic republic. He kind of moved a little bit to help with the ratification of the constitution. But he realized the United States would ultimately fail if it did not have a strong central government. We would be invaded by foreign powers. We'd be taken over by foreign powers. We needed to have a strong economic power and a strong military power. And he actually began building our really began building our navy. Um Monroe will take this over and actually start building a really strong army. Uh especially after the Monroe Doctrine, uh and the expansion westward and it'll start making a very strong military beginnings of a military. But Madison, it was one of his biggest regrets and limitations, the performance of the War of 1812. And there's actually a really beautiful correspondence that begins uh less with Madison, but really with Adams and

12:43 Jefferson after this time, after Madison's presidency. Madison is really the Monroe is actually the last of these founding father presidents, but Madison is the end of the the Jefferson dynasty really as we know it. This Democratic Republicans and there's a beautiful dialogue back and forth between them and Madison Hamilton will have have this where they were they admit that they were at each other's throats. Actually, these letters do not start so nice. Uh the first thing is Adam sends a letter to Jefferson and says and um obviously he didn't say it quite like this but like look at that your project was such a [ __ ] failure and walks out. Madison was not an utter failure. I mean he actually helped modernize the country a lot and passed a lot of strong reforms and things that helped our nation. Uh but nonetheless uh Adams would take any dig he could of the Democratic Republicans and vice versa. Uh, and just know when Adams left administration, they were just as cruel to him. Uh, talking calling him a loser.

13:46 He did. Adams lost for the second election when he lost against Jefferson. Um, actually famously partially because of Hamilton who threw part of his weight behind Jefferson. Um, which is crazy to think that that could happen. I mean, today I'm assuming, and maybe I'm wrong, I'm not a part of those inner circles. It would be wild to see um I don't know JD Vance break off and support uh Kristen Cinema so that way she could become uh a president. I just don't think you would you don't see that kind of bipartisan what's best for the country. Also though Hamilton secretly not not so secretly then but really disliked Adams uh on a personal level not even as much on a political one. just thought he was an [ __ ] and a lot of people did. So, they're very mean to one another, but there's this eventual reconciliation that happens. John has three sons. One of them very famously, John Quincy Adams, who uh wildly is actually a

14:51 Democratic Republican and ends up serving in Madison's administration and later becomes president. Um, but Adams is ends up realizing that these people aren't quite the devil. Um and begin Adams is the one who actually extends the first olive branch uh to be amicable. Uh and truthfully I I would be remiss if I did not say actually the lady behind him was so important to the United States uh that Abigail Adams was so important to the US and the Adams administration particularly with entertainment of foreign diplomats and uh understandings. uh she at her pushing got John to write to Jefferson and then later there would be correspondence uh amongst others. Um and she she also was a fierce thinker about the maintaining the neutrality which uh obviously Jefferson and Madison uh at the time when Adams was uh

15:55 president and when Washington was president were vehematly opposed to. I mean they're very very pro- French. Um and she did a magnificent job of steer helping steer the Adams administration toward neutrality and she's not one that's really talked about very often. Uh she was very brilliant. She was educated um deeply devoutly religious much like John and they had those their three sons and John Quincy Adams would later be president. They had another son Thomas u who also was a lawyer uh and an alcoholic. Um he moved back home to Brain Tree where Adams retired to to be a farmer. Um and he ended up dying at a young age. Um the Adams family had a pretty horrible personal life and and John started writing basically a lot of philosophical work and treatises um which Jefferson and Madison both enjoyed uh at a certain point. They were really impressed by everybody was impressed. John was was a good writer. Um but he had John had a really horrible personal life. I mean, his relationship with his wife is

16:55 wonderful, but his kids, aside from John Quincy Adams, who was never home, uh, they both died from alcoholism. Um, and he became really depressed and it was really beautiful. You know, Jefferson at first is riding angrily to disagree politically with Adams and then they kind of bond. I mean, Jefferson's loss of his wife um, and then the loss of his daughter. Jeff, when Jefferson's daughter died in pregnancy, um, Jefferson was very distraught. It's actually an episode of a mailman coming to deliver something to Jefferson after his daughter died. And the mailman writes uh postmaster, which back then actually was a big deal. Uh the postmaster writes that there was this six-foot redhead [ __ ] basically who answered the door and screamed at me. I thought a president was supposed to be a titan, a wonderful person. He said Jefferson was a complete animal. and Jefferson and Adams mostly through Abigail uh bonded over this like fair this shared hardship personal hardship that really hit them and they end up

17:56 becoming friends and this is something that I think is really beautiful that Adams ends up accepting. They aren't the same faith. Um they aren't even the same lineage. Uh there's a obviously a mix there, but they and they don't have shared ideas at all, but they end up sharing something that looks a lot like friendship and brotherhood that beats all of these uh which is really I think quite beautiful in a tale of America. uh which leads us to our next next part which is what I'll coin the second founding of America uh which is extremely monumental and I want to talk the same way I talk about Adams and Madison I want to talk about James Long Street and Ulysius Srant two also titans um who were super super important I'm going to start with long street James Long Street was born in

19:01 South Carolina to a moderately wealthy plantation family. He is educated in Augusta, Georgia, uh where he goes to a military academy and he performs mediocrely. Uh he lives with his uh aunt and uncle and he ends up getting to West Point, not through Georgia. a family cannot uh afford to I don't want to say corrupt but uh get the Georgia congressman to sign him for West Point. So they use Long Street's uh aunt's maternal line to get him as an Alabama appointee. Uh so you have a by birth South Carolinian man who identifies as a Georgian uh and who grew up in Georgia and really is a product of Georgia uh being Alabama's representative at West Point. Uh, and he goes up there and he again does really mediocrely. Uh, nothing special about Long Street. He's a rich kid who doesn't

20:01 do well, who gets in fights with people, who's a little bit of an [ __ ] to people. Um, the thing they write about him and where he meets Grant is at West Point's library reading what would effectively be comic books. Uh, the two of them meet and become best friends. So, let's jump to Ulysus Grant. Ulysus Grant was actually born into a working-class, more impoverished family uh in Ohio. And uh Grant's family uh his father jumped around to all different jobs. So, it was a blacksmith, carpenter, tor uh for a time. And Grant is his his parents are very religious uh deep abolitionists. uh very much disagree with slavery. Uh very very religious. Um they let Grant Grant has an affinity for memorizing the Bible. Um something uh a president who appoints him also has a deep affinity about. Um and Grant's family and town save up

21:04 money to send him to school. Uh they realize that he's very smart. They actually exempt him from going to uh church three times a week. They let him stay at home and read the Bible instead. Uh which is miraculous for such a religious family at the time. And they send uh Grant to a town uh in southern Ohio to become educated. And Grant is the top of his class. Uh and he particularly excels in athleticism, which he's actually Long Street is a six-foot southern gentleman. Uh Grant is 5'8. Uh a little bit on the heavier set side, but exceptionally strong and a great athlete. Um, Grant is top of his class there and he ends up getting a bid to go to West Point through his own merits, not as much through corruption. Grant gets to West Point and [ __ ] hates it. Absolutely hates it. He thinks that they are totalitarians. He says, "This is bologoney that I have to wake up at 5:30 and go marching. Uh, I don't like taps. I don't know if taps existed the song yet." Uh, he doesn't like any of it. And Grant actually does very

22:08 mediocrely there as well. Uh, shockingly so. He is the best horseman in his class though. Um, which is odd because he actually will not be assigned to the calvary, which is very weird that that happens. Normally that would not. He was top of his class for horse. And these two were in class together. And uh, they used to call Grant Sam. Uh, they called him Sam because somebody messed up on his paperwork. Remember Grant was not from a wealthy family that could help him. They put and the congressman thought his name was US Grant and thought the S they didn't know if it was a joke or what. They thought it might be Uncle Sam, which that idea did exist by then. They were like, "We don't know what it stands for." They called him started calling him Sam. Um, and Long Street and him become fast friends. Yeah. What was his actual middle name? Uh, yeah. Simpson. Yeah. Um, so they he ends up there and he and Long Street become very fast friends. Sorry, one second. And let me just check out we're doing on

23:15 time. Take a few more minutes. Um, become fast friends. They're both mediocre in their class and uh they graduate. Uh, Grant is actually sent into infantry which is wild because that he wasn't good at it. I don't know why they didn't put him in calvary. It makes no sense to me. I I don't know. But they end up serving together. They get stationed together. And actually later Grant will end up marrying Long Street's cousin uh in Missouri. And there's great a great reckoning that Grant has. Uh his uh Long Street's cousin actually I mean Long Street comes from a slaveolding family and Grant inherits from this marriage a slave. Um, and Grant like wrestles with this himself and is actually quite anti-slavery, but Grant after he's released from the military, and I'll talk about his military service in a minute, is economically destitute and doesn't know what to do. So, he ends up having two slaves. One is a direct gift from his

24:19 father-in-law and one through an inheritance from his wife. The one from his father-in-law, he actually frees the minute he gets him. Um, and there's a he and Long Street have a correspondence and Long Street's pissed. He's like, "Why don't you just at least sell sell him or let him save up money to buy his uh freedom?" It's like, even if you had only done it for $100, Grant says, "I just can't do it." He said, "That's not God did not intend this to be the way." Um, and Grant wrestles himself about it because he's not even from a moral standpoint, but he says, "I I feel like I'm failing my family." Um, and there's a big thing. He feels like he's not a man. Uh, Grant at this time is deeply uh alcoholic. He's sent to the Western Frontiers uh after the he's these two actually served together in the Mexican-American War under Lee uh and under uh Scott uh and again they end up still being fast friends, but they are sent to different places. Uh, Long Street is sent to Texas, uh, an outpost there. And Grant

25:20 is sent up to the north, the western states, Mountain West, and Grant is really depressed that he no longer has any friends. He no longer has his wife. Um, he is not assigned to the Calvary, which he actually has a he's very shined by. Um, and Grant has a really hard time, and he becomes deeply depressed. Um, and he becomes he gets a two-month leave to go back when his uh kid is born. And um, when he has to go back to the military, he he writes really sad parts about leaving his wife and leaving his friends. And Grant just becomes a really big alcoholic at the time. And it's actually really sad to to read about this stuff. And when Grant gets back again, I I told you he freed the slave. His business uh ventures all fail. Um he ends up selling firewood on the streets of St. Louis to try to make ends meet. Um he just goes in the forest all day and like chops wood. Um and he's just really depressed and he's having

26:21 this correspondence with Long Street. Meanwhile, Long Street's like living it up. Uh you know, he's pretty wealthy, doing doing well. Um and John C. Calhoun writes his fire breather statements and neither of them are super neither Long Street nor Grant are super political. Um they are tossed into a situation. Um I think we'll take a quick pause there and uh we'll come back to that situation. So we left off with uh Long Street and Grant who were not uber political being hoisted into a new situation. Um, obviously that situation is what uh ends up happening in South Carolina. Um, and there is a now a civil war and they have to choose a side and there's actually correspondence between the two. Um, Long Street is uh very hesitant to to fight it all. Um, Long Street is I mean he served under Scott

27:26 in Mexico. Um, and I just want to say that Lee also was very hesitant about fighting. And remember Lee is actually approached to be head of the Union Army. Um, ends up being Scott who is old and doesn't know anything about modern warfare when the time comes. But eventually Long Street joins the Confederate cause and he fights under the Northern Army of Virginia as one of the generals under Lee. Um, Lee is a very peculiar leadership style. Um, Lee is a very hands-off under uh as opposed to Braxton uh under the Army of the Tennessee and Army of the West who is much more hands-on. Uh, I think there's no doubt Lee was the much more successful general of the two uh Confederate big dogs. Um, Long Street was actually very very good at environment battles. Uh, he understood landscape and topography much better than Lee did, much better than many generals in the Confederacy. He was not the best at union, I mean at unit

28:28 movement, but he was still quite a good general. And actually, one of the things Long Street is most famous for is warning Lee about Gettysburg. Um, there's a lot of controversy about this, but uh Long Street warns him about Pickicket's charge, warns him about a number of movements at Gettysburg. Uh, and Lee does not listen to Long Street. Uh, obviously that was a uh for the Confederate cause uh calamity at that point. uh which that alone does not cause the Confederates were going to lose anyways. Uh but that was a catalyst for uh much of that. And Long Street is so mad after Gaysburg that he actually signs up to go fight under Braxton instead. Um where Long Braxton is much more hands-on and Long Street actually suffers uh what would be defeats. Uh again, uh I think that it was inevitable at this point. Uh the Union was going to win, especially as Grant starts coming in. They actually don't face each other

29:30 until the Battle of the Wilderness. Uh which ends up being a really, really bloody battle. Um, and Long Street actually is able to push his friend back when he gets there, but Long Street actually comes late uh to the chagrin of the Northern Army of Virginia, but it actually c catches the Union off foot, weirdly enough. So, his mistake ends up being a big tactical advantage. Obviously, Long Street gets injured at the Battle of Wilderness and then uh they end up losing the entire war. Um they meet again uh at Appamatics and when Grant invites them in, he asks for special somebody obviously to come for the Confederate surrender and it's uh well Lee's obviously going to be there but it's uh he asked for Long Street to be there and Long Street they come in and at this point Lee still looks like the austere gentleman but they're they come in rags. They the Southerners have depleted almost everything they had. I mean, at the Battle of the Wilderness, there's talks about how the Confederates hardly had

30:33 they started throwing rocks. They had no more ammunition to use. Um, which is ironic because Long Street actually gets shot by his own troop. So, one of those precious bullets ends up shooting him. Um, and they meet there and Grant, this is where actually Grant at the beginning becomes so popular even with Southerners. Um he is so gracious to the Confederates who come through and allows all the Confederates to leave with their arms, which is a big deal back then to not have to disarm yourself, to not have to there's a a manliness message that comes through and they all shake hands and the peace terms that Lincoln allows Grant to extend are nothing short of the most kind peace terms you could ever ask for. I mean really what had happened to other rebellions at times. Um normally not only would Jeff Davis be beheaded but Long Street Lee everybody on down. Um and there would have been uh

31:35 total what later be used martial law of a place. Um the union terms are so gracious and I mean that very seriously that there there was a Grant was uh a gentleman uh a true gentleman to uh Lee and to Long Street. And part of that had to do with his friendship with Long Street. Even though they had battled against each other um even though when Grant crushed Vixsburg um even when uh Long Street there's a correspondence between them partially in the war. Long Street's writing to his cousin uh who you know Grant marries. It's like what the hell are you doing? You know you're going to ruin your own family. Um and Grant responds as a gentleman. I mean there really is um a beautiful friendship and when they they meet they actually embrace each other as old friends. I mean again they're part of the same class. They've known each other most their lives. Um, and these two men uh get to rebuild who have different

32:40 come from different walks of life. Again, they're not uber political. Um, which will end up that actually will end up haunting Grant later. He'll be sort of uh taking over what will be taken over what will then later be coined as the uh Monopoly class. uh the develop the prototypes of the Carnegies who will start coming and start taking over Grant which will tarnish his reputation later. Um they embrace and Grant asks Long Street to take over the one of the greatest responsibilities of all time and that's helping rehabilitate the South. There is this and this is I'm skipping a little bit after Johnson and Lincoln and I actually am going to talk about Lincoln uh at the end who's one of the greatest American thinkers of all time. Um Grant trusts Long Street to peacefully and nicely bring about the South. And Long Street actually leads a mixed coalition of troops against a

33:42 white rebellion. in uh southern Tennessee. Um and Long Street helps with the um what would be the beginnings of reconstruction, but rather than merely just a martial law type thing, he actually brings in economic capabilities and he's able he's a direct ear to Grant. Uh he's able to directly get aid. There is a huge there ends up becoming a split in the south. Obviously reconstruction was very unpopular in lots of the south mainly due to the bajgeois who had lost their power. Um people who had built their power uh I'll use an example uh Nathan Bedford Forest who had built up a power of Memphis and northern Mississippi uh they were displaced and they end up founding and creating things uh terror groups. Um Grant trusts Long Street to help curtail that. And the problem Wall Street does is he economically is much more successful at rehabilitating the Carolinas, particularly the coasts where trade is

34:45 good and New Orleans. He ends up living in New Orleans and he's able to rehabilitate those. He's not as successful in what all the deep south, Birmingham, Memphis, Jackson, Atlanta even, uh he's not as successful in rehabilitating those places. Uh and I think that's part that ends up hurting reconciliation. Uh but it does bring I mean places like New Orleans that end up becoming these like absolute monuments and wonderful places of economic and uh might literature philosophy that stem from them that have a lot of southern thought that come from these places. Uh so Long Street takes some good care of these places but really fails part and utterly fails Appalachia. Um who is just actually not only does he fail that but reconstruction doesn't even touch Appalachia. Um so there's not even a chance for them to be really ruled they just are economically left totally alone and isolated. Um and so these are actually kind of failures of Long Street on that part. But I don't want to give

35:47 him, you do need to give him his just dues that southern Louisiana um other port cities uh do prosper under long street stewardship. Um and Grant is again to many of these continued traders and terrorists, Grant is very peaceful and very forgiving. um and their friendship even with disagreement. I mean it's you have to understand Long Street received death threats every single day uh by terror organizations and their friendship is what kept this balance and kept another civil war from breaking out. Long Street was able to hold the South together and keep it from breaking and keeping another civil war from emerging. And Grant's uh generosity and his ability to say I'm a handsoff. this is going to hurt him. He says, "I'm I'll be a hands-off president and let you help sail the ship." Now, this ends up cutting both ways. First, Grant is terrible with his money. Absolutely

36:49 horrendous. Second, Grant is hands off to Long Street, not just because of friendship, but because Grant is a very hands-off person from anything that isn't military. He doesn't want to be involved. He didn't want to be president, by the way. It's actually very much thrust upon him. He didn't He says, "I never was a real politician. The only thing I ever even cared about was slavery. I guess I would be uh, you know, a part of this, but he doesn't want to at all. And his administration, reconstruction is so dilapitated when it go parts of it are oppressive, parts of it are not, parts of it are inconsistent throughout the South. Um, he also lets the, uh, industrialists be quite powerful. um which behooves some aspects of Congress. Uh sort of one of the notions, you know, Congress has stayed wealthy throughout its entire history. Um they no longer had to fully serve in Congress. They could just pay uh you know, before Congress was filled with Virginia wealthy planters, the rich, no doubt. Well, now the good news was is

37:54 that the industrialists didn't have to actually run for office. They could just pay somebody and they could just sit back in New York and chill. Uh so that was nice uh for for for them. So Grant, you know, I don't want to give the conception that he was guess he was a very nice man and he was a brilliant military tactician and leader. Um very effective as was Long Street. Uh they did they were not perfect by any means, but this difference of opinion, this friendship lasted them through the bloodiest conflict on American soil that we've ever seen. And it's it's pretty amazing. Um, Long Street eventually gets rehabilitated uh his reputation and name uh by his second wife in the early 1900s. Uh he's dead, but his second wife does that. I don't know. Uh Grant gets mixed reviews uh throughout his life, but I I think I would be remissed if I didn't talk about Abraham Lincoln. Um, and I call this these guys are the the Roger Sherman and the um the um George Clinton or the Monroe or the Patrick

39:04 Henry of the second founding of America. What do I mean by the second founding of America? The second founding of America happens right after the Civil War and it's a ratification of the ideals of the Constitution. The founders wrote about a lot of it's based off of Jefferson's written letters and it's about how these rights apply to all Americans. Okay. The 14th Amendment. So 13th Amendment and slavery. 14th amendment says anybody born of American soul is an American and deserves all rights therein that includes all the slaves who are there doesn't quite yet apply to women but it applies to all men in the United States regardless of religion regardless of race and this is so important it's why it's coined the second founding of the United States a lot of this is again based off of Jefferson's Madison's and Adams works where they recognized A lot of what they were doing was needed to be reckoned with one day. And

40:11 I think this was set in stone by a man born in Kentucky in a log cabin who grew up in Indiana in the wilderness and then moved to Illinois to make some money. That was Abraham Lincoln. Abraham Lincoln's family was displaced uh out of Kentucky because of slavery. his dad did not believe in it. Uh, and they economically lost out. Uh, they were the losers and they ended up moving to Indiana. Abraham Lincoln, his uh, a lot of his his parents died when he was young. But, uh, he taught himself to read and write. He, uh, worked on the farm for his father. Um, and he was very devoutly religious, something he bonded about with Grant as he memorized passages of the Bible, would read it. It was the only book they had in their home. Um Lincoln would teach himself. He was really into wrestling. Uh which is really random. Really loved to wrestle. Uh for those of you I know that it's now popular you do jiu-jitsu. Is that like

41:12 there's a he very much believed in the idea of one has to be uh there's a very big purpose for athleticism and even if it's just taking a walk and there's a big purpose for feeding the brain too. And Lincoln really really believed in that stuff. And Lincoln was uh you know he taught again he taught himself to read and write, ends up memorizing the Bible, ends up going to school. He's not college educated. He ends up studying the law at first on his own. Um and he ends up uh he too was a uh he filled out a myriad of jobs. He worked as a blacksmith for a little while, a carpenter. Uh he apparently tried to be a tailor in his third cousin's shop and sucked because he had really big hands. He was not a good tailor. So he's fired. Um and he eventually ends up becoming a lawyer because that's what one does when they fail at a lot of things. Um and he ends up becoming decently successful. Uh and he runs for the state legislature

42:15 uh and wins. Uh he then tries to run for governor and loses and he eventually ends up in Congress and does exceedingly well. He's a gifted speaker. Um and Lincoln ends up and I'm sorry I know I'm going quickly. He ends up Do you have a question or no? Okay. the uh he ends up eventually winning the election partially due to a split in the vote because there's a famous Tennessian who runs and then there are other folks who run. The presidential race uh ends up being quite populated. Um and then the South secedes when Lincoln wins. Lincoln's a Republican and uh the party stance is obviously anti-slavery, certainly anti-growth of slavery for sure. Um and Lincoln He was really a uh quite a good first reader of other people. Um he he had to let Scott be the first uh

43:23 leader um because of his work in the Mexican-American War. There's political pressure. Scott sucked. I mean, just sucked. He was fighting. I mean, it was like when the Prussians fought the the the French when Napoleon was there. I mean, so woefully behind and outdated. Um, they couldn't measure and and Lee was such a better tactician. Even Braxton was a better tactician, uh, than Scott at that time. Um, there was the Confederates were much better at using guerrilla warfare, uh, not true guerilla warfare, but a form of it. Um the Union still believed in uh their superior firepower lining up in lines would do the trick. Uh it did not. Um and the Union Scott was a huge fan of cavalry rushes and he would rush right into Confederate artillery. Um from long distances, not even up close. Um but Scott believed in the gallant man on the in the calvary charge and a lot of actually young uh wellto-d do men who

44:25 were in the Union calvary died. uh at the beginning of the war uh which really styied the Union's efforts to win quickly which they thought I mean uh some of you might I mean the first few battles were actually literally watched by onlookers for entertainment because they thought it was going to be so fast so quick the Confederates would lose so quickly and they were so flabbergasted when not only the Confederates win but it was so bloody. I mean, horrific, horrific battles. And this was people like Long Street and Grant killing each other. My direct family fought on one side, but I have cousins uh from who fought on both sides of the war. Many Americans families were split. Um you know, there are stories whether or not these are fully true. There was a um he was a lieutenant for the Confederates and he sent his son up to be educated in the north uh who they're at a they're at um

45:26 the Battle of Cerville and uh he shoots he shoots somebody who says don't shoot and ends up being his son. I doubt that that's true but there are numerous actual occasions of brother killing brother cousin killing cousin especially from the border states Missouri, Kentucky, Maryland. Uh pretty horrific. Scott County here, Knox County here. Um a lot of fighting. Um even uh Davidson County, I mean there was a lot of Sam Houston um governor of Tennessee was a strong strong unionist. Um and was basically kicked out of the state. Um legendary man also, you know, semi-pioneer frontiersman to an extent. Um it was a lot of brother against brother and pretty horrific fighting and these two I think embleize that at a larger picture. Uh and there's a lot more paperwork to read about them than there are others. Um Lincoln saw that and was very disgusted.

46:36 It's actually why he had Grant help pick Sherman. Um Sherman's very famous for his March to the Sea, which I think everybody here knows about to an extent. Um and it really was a total warfare march uh across the South to the Atlantic. Um, and Lincoln writes about how sad he is that that had to happen, but he views it as something that did need to happen to end the war as quickly as possible. And you know, there's accounts at Gettysburg. I mean, many of you know the famous speech he gave upon these hollow grounds. You know, he really meant it. And he was really sad watching all these people just [ __ ] die who were cousins. And also it economically destroyed the United States. It set us back generations and it ultimately created a horrific split in the South. Um Lincoln

47:37 was filled with lamentation about it. um when he writes the Emancipation Proclamation um there's no doubt Lincoln was anti-slavery um for sure wholly through he'll tell you from his own writings that he obviously fought the Civil War to hold and preserve the Union um slavery was important to him um he also used uh that is a very effective tool in warfare um Emancipation Proclamation helped set up um black units um Actually, there's a very famous battle that Nathan Bedford Forest took part in uh against a black unit that is uh the study of many controversies. Um but Lincoln was very very smart and was able to coales uh coales this and he certainly believed in emancipation. I mean there's no doubt he was very anti-slavery. Um and then when the war is ending, Lincoln is the one who tells Grant,

48:38 Grant's a soldier. He's got to do what the president says. Lincoln is the one who has the generous terms. Um Lincoln believes in a reconstruction. Um we I'm happy Johnson is not part of my talk, but I'm happy to talk about him. Um but Lincoln believes in reconstruction, but in whole he definitely believes in mercy and grace to all of the South. Um, I think there's probably not a greater more complex figure in American history than him or pretty damn close. There's an order that's issued by the Supreme Court uh having to do with habius corpus um basically uh a form of sentencing for judges that the Supreme Court says you cannot suspend it Lincoln unilaterally. Congress needs to to agree to that. Lincoln uh taking words from Jackson uh basically says you've made your order. I see that you you go ahead and try to enforce that. Lincoln ignores the sup

49:39 it's a procurium opinion which is a little different than a full Supreme Court order. Uh procurium means only one justice wrote it for an emergency uh posture, but he ignores it which is a which is a big deal. Um it's one of the very first times in history a president ignores a Supreme Court order. Um, Lincoln, especially in Maryland, cracks down on freedom of speech. Um, now Lincoln is a part of a pool, and I think this will be different when we compare him to Long Street or Grant. Lincoln is part of a pool almost to the extent that the ends justify the means. And I would say that Jefferson and Adams are similarly a part of that pool. You then have people like Long Street, Grant, Madison who believe in the processes and the procedures and that's what makes us that those protections that sixth amendment that right to counsel the right to a jury trial that's what makes us special not the ends justify

50:43 the means. Lincoln Adams and Jefferson did not believe that just so you know. Uh but there was a compromise that happened and Lincoln was not the lone figure to at the second founding when he made this idea that we are created and that we are all equal and that we all deserve equal representation in the law and we all have equal powers before it. And then he's assassinated and Johnson does a bangup job. Uh, so the uh the uh and I'm sorry I didn't mean to like very quickly peruse through but I know that we have uh I don't think the lunch is at one but does anyone have questions otherwise I'll go back and fill in things or carry on with Johnson. I can I can carry on with Johnson. I can go back. Um, okay. Yeah. I guess very briefly to what extent do you think like Lincoln's reconstruction

51:50 like happens in a different way is because of like ideological differences or the sort of or like a more economic like when you read some of the stuff that they originally planned to do it sort of sounds more like the literal word reconstruction like there's a lot of plans for like roads economic development. Most of that doesn't happen. Correct. Why do you think that is? Is it just like they they don't have money or I think there are multiple reasons. One, Lincoln was just a great planner. Um again, he he really was a brilliant man. Um two, I think Johnson styied a lot of this stuff. Um Johnson actually was a good guy. should never have been put in that situation and did a horrible job. Johnson actually did try to hold the Union and he did not pardon at first

52:50 every Confederate Lincoln wrote to do that. Um but Johnson did wait and he wanted to make sure the southerners swore feelalty again back to the Constitution. Um Johnson also was an alcoholic uh did not take criticism well. um and he ruined a lot of the early efforts and when Grant got in, Grant did take Lincoln not Lincoln's notes and that's why he pointed Long Street and Long Street did a great job rebuilding New Orleans and Charleston uh where there were economic powers already but and they rebuilt streets there, helped with progress in ports, but yeah, I mean they've entirely failed the middle the entire middle section of the South. Um, Long Street was not a city planner, was not an economic developer. He was a soldier. Um, and he knew some port stuff and navy stuff that he could talk to friends about. Also, it's really easy to build rebuild New Orleans and Charleston when they were not utterly destroyed and they are on great positions. whereas it's much harder to rebuild um Jackson, Mississippi or Vixsburg, Mississippi um

53:58 or certainly anywhere in Appalachia who that had no foundation for any of this stuff. I mean the Tri Cities I mean all this stuff had had nothing and Grant was too busy also with other affairs. Um, you know, at this time Grant was sort of depressed by criticism at this point. Grant obviously has depression in case anybody was wondering. Um, and he also is just kind of a very hands-off president, which is actually what a lot of founders envisioned the president to be. But people were unhappy when they found out that the president was not always steering the ship and that Long Street was steering the South, a part of the South. Um, you know, and other characters were uh particularly the beginnings of the steel and mill movements who became uh really and the beginnings of mining power also that became really quite strong. Um, you know, the the train cars in Chicago, the the meat freeze packers that just started in the

55:05 1870s. Um, I think Grant and Long Street were hopelessly overwhelmed at a certain and so they yes, they did not build any roads. I mean, the the dirt road between Memphis and Nashville was better pre the Civil War than it was post. And it was never I mean it's not until Wilson and then really FDR where the South is actually rebuilt. Um aside from again I don't want to say you know Charleston and New Orleans parts of Florida tangentally Memphis and Atlanta and Nashville have a different history. Uh the bigger cities recovered much more successfully but because they had commerce beforehand. I mean there was a a writing Memphis was stricken by yellow fever. Memphis was peered to Atlanta pre the civil war and uh it was obviously the cotton capital big trade hub of the deep south and Memphis was stricken by yellow fever and the Memphis leadership and Shelby County

56:10 leadership uh wrote to Grant to ask for money and support. Apparently Grant never got the letter. Um, so we don't know why or how that happened, but there was a lot of just disorganization. So I do think Grant was probably a good president for the time and to fill the spot. I'm not sure who would have done a better job, but you you did probably need Lincoln the same way you needed Truman. Um there was something about having that person who was who steered the ship to continue doing it at least for a little bit. Um you know and Truman filled a void. It would have been remarkable if Johnson could have been the the Truman to you know FDR and Lincoln to fill the comparison. But uh Truman filled the shoes that Johnson could not. And Grant I think Grant did the best he could. I think he actually did a decent job. Um,

57:10 I'm not so sure that other politicians at the time were up to the task and would have been as successful. Um, Henry Clay's son or I'm sorry, nephew. Um, he was a blowhard. I mean, these a lot of these guys were either so ideological and not willing to I mean, the you have some fire breathers in the south who were asking for a second secession. Um you had terror groups in the south and you had the the radical Republicans in the north. Um these not just intense abolitionists but believed in like hanging all the Confederates. Um it was a really tough time. I think Grant did the best he could and he also got to the game late. Um that's a really good question though. Anybody else? Yeah. It's a question that's maybe Maybe a little tangential. So the the characters and the relationships between Long Street,

58:15 Grant, Adams, Jefferson, Madison, is most of this something that later historians have gone back and then reconstructed it or was it something that you would have a media or some other broader understanding that this was occurring at at that time? Because now obviously the relationships are obiscated by propaganda and sensation, but we do have a pretty we the public follows quite closely these sorts of interactions and relationships. And I'm wondering if the public was completely oblivious to it or slightly aware or very aware. That's a great question. So these two, they're very aware. There's actually political cartoons and uh maligning them. There's a picture. It's Long Street. He's big and Grant is very tiny sitting on Long Street's lap and Long Street's petting him and it just says the South making us eat soup and uh Grant's like crying and Long Street's comforting baby Grant and there so there

59:17 were these two were famously known but to the others uh Jefferson and Adams were not known at the time that they reconciled. Uh it was known that they hated each other. Um, I mean, basically, uh, Adams imprisoned Jefferson's chief of staff, uh, when, uh, not his, his chief publicist, uh, who had the newspaper company. Um, they were, I guess there was public, uh, knowhow of their hate, but and but there was very little public knowhow of people when they reconciled like Patrick Henry in Washington. I talked about when Washington begged Patrick Henry to quail the Virginiaians, that was not public. Um, and some of them, I mean, Washington was more private, uh, Madison was more private, Adams more private, Jefferson was more open, uh, than them. So, to some extent though, that drama was unfolding in the public eye. Some question on that then, how much of that was sensation

1:00:21 as opposed to legitimate gripes? I imagine that a lot of the information you're talking about is coming from personal letters and other inside accounts. But again, I'm think I'm trying to think of it through the lens of our own time. It would be, you know, Trump and Musk global law. Yes, these things are occurring, but also they're occurring under the shadow of a lot of propaganda and media spin. I think it's a really good question. Um, you know, for some of it there was certainly media spin. Um, I think there was a real vitriol that some of it like Burn Hamilton had a real vitriol. Um, so there was some of it there. I think some of it with Adams was really particularly played up because a lot of the a lot of people really hated Adams. He was he was just kind of an [ __ ] He really was. He was like this short, balding, big-nosed chubby dude who like was just kind of mean-spirited. again very smart um and religiously self-righteous

1:01:25 very self-righteous he was he he was one of those holier than now I know better than you um the media did play up a lot of his stuff to make him look bad um it's probably doubtful he hated Madison as much um I do think the media was sensationalizing their relationship I think he and Jefferson were sincerely bitter Um the media largely ignored Madison in Washington's which was actually was publicly known but the media decided to quell it. I don't know why. Um probably what they assume stability but the media was very scared to publish critiques of Washington. Um that was probably part of it. So the media would choose to censor some things on their own. Um Adams administration obviously was the media was censored in general. Um, that's a great question. I mean, so sometimes it was for some I just don't know. Um, especially with especially with some of the more northeast leadership. I mean, George

1:02:31 Clinton uh is a good uh Mansour of New York, another good one. Roger Sherman such as Harter. And I'm not I'm much more familiar with the Virginiaians. Um, that's a great question though. And I if you find out the answer to the rest of it, only ones I know are Jefferson, Adams, Madison, you know, the big those ones, but for the other ones, I'd be very interested to know. It's a that's a great question. Um I'm sorry I couldn't answer that better. No, actually a lot. Yeah. Are there any books you would recommend as far as examining the relationship with Long Street and Grant or any other biographical material look? Grant's biography uh is a is a great one. Uh I I highly recommend it. It's very interesting. Long Street. Uh there is a biography of Long Street. There's also a a good uh I can't remember who there's a miniseries on him on YouTube. I cannot remember who does it. I watched it a long time ago, but I remember enjoying it. Um I would say Grant's Biography. Um there's another

1:03:32 I can Google it. It's the It's the one that came out. He has an autobiography that's Grant. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Grant. So Grant has an autobiography that's actually pretty good. There's a biography that recently came out though, I want to say in the last 20 years or so that's probably more honest than the autobiography and is pretty good. I can tell you the author if my phone will load. Yes. When it loads, I will tell you. Um there's another book that's called uh the the good military gentleman um by Brian Steel. Uh he was a he was a Emory grad actually and um he writes about just basically these all these guys from who were in class together. They're all within almost four years of each other

1:04:32 who are the a lot of them end up becoming military leaders in the Confederacy, but a number of them in the Union and all of them go to the Mexican-American War as junior officers because there are a lot of them actually, which is very weird. Um, you know, a lot of times the local leadership, like Nathan Bever, for example, was just a militia leader. Um, and he ends up mostly staying in West Tennessee and northern Mississippi. But there are a number of officers who all served together who like were roommates and more Confederacy, but still a number of Union and they all knew each other and were friends. Uh, which is really crazy. So that that's going by Brian Steel that I uh definitely recommend. Um, I'm trying to think of other uh good Civil War pieces. There's another one by uh Brian Steel. uh which is called Nathan Bedford Forest which is about the western frontier and obviously about Nathan Bedford Forest but uh it talks about Braxton a lot uh who's was a decent man but a not a very good

1:05:37 general um I'm sure there are worse uh he had a very hands-on military style which for some worked um that's a a pretty good book that's also Brian Steel Mills Um, I'm trying to think of another good find that like history is a good Yeah. Yeah, it's definitely decent. Um, if you like real nittygritty Civil War books, and I say this as a Memphian, so you have to forgive me, but Shelby Foot is probably the best writer of the Civil War. Um, and it but it's very long. What did you write? He wrote The Civil War. It's a It is a three book odyssey. I'm saying each one is like 3,000 pages. Um I read the first two. I skimmed the third. Uh because it is it is an endeavor of love. Um he also appears on like a lot of documentaries. I think the most famous one is the Ken

1:06:37 Burns uh PBS1 Civil War. I just highly recommend anything that he talks or writes. He's kind of a Faulner-esque goes on uh but he is a fun read and for the Civil War probably the best most detailed account of like battle per battle of anybody and he does a great job talking about all these guys especially Long Street um at his time at Shelby Foot's time 80s and previously especially when the lost cause narrative was so popular um long street and even Lee to an extent were maligned uh foot does a good job rehabilitating them. Um you know Lee Lee's glorified right after the Civil War and he ends up going back uh he's in his own way a Catis. He ends up going and teaching at Washington College which later become Washington Lee and he actually is has a quiet life and he doesn't want to be involved in politics and he does a good job of being a demonstration to the southern elites

1:07:37 to stop. um he later in the 1920s uh particularly around right after when Birth of a Nation comes out is seen as a loser. Um and there's a split in what's called the lost cause narrative which is a a theory an incorrect theory about the South's role in the Civil War and there are sort of two thought pools. One of them glorifies Lee, one of them absolutely hates Lee. Um and Foot does a good job rehabilitating. But I highly recommend Shelby Foot. Um Brian Steelmills is is also really good. Um I definitely recommend both of them for Civil War stuff. Yeah. And I'll make I'll make one book suggestion and it's not Civil War, it's Founders. I have to tell you the best Founders book. It's probably The Three Lives of James Madison by Noah Feldman. Um absolutely. It obviously focuses on Madison. Um, but it goes through all of the founders and it talks about the adaptation and arguments the constitution. It has some

1:08:40 of Madison's notes. Um, Madison didn't uh change any of his notes. Jefferson famously when he realized that it was going to be a library and he was going to donate edited his notes uh to which uh he didn't want people to see everything he wrote. And look, we're all humans sometimes. I'm sure he wrote like, "I had to take a shit." Uh, and I'm sitting in this meeting and it's really hot and I'm tired. And he edited, he edits parts of it. Uh, but the only two people who take note, real notes at the Morrison's not there, but at the constitutional convention is Madison Hamilton. For some reason, a room full of brilliant people allegedly nobody else took notes, which is wild. Like I don't know how the Adams family and all these brilliant people sat there Washington all these people who sat Franklin and nobody took nobody thought to take notes. I think we need to ask Pam Bondi to release the notes. Got Yeah. Got to have Pam Bonnie released. I I'm sure part of it had to do with them being fearful if it was

1:09:42 discovered. They didn't want everybody to find it and stuff. I'm sure things were burned. I'm sure people more people took notes. Um yeah. Yeah. whatever it was or or even just sold them. I mean, that was very common. Some of the founders had a lifestyle they wanted to keep, but back then when you served in Congress, it was a gentleman's club and you were not paid. Um, so they would write things and sell them and sell original copies. So, I'm sure that all of those were the result of that. But, uh, I that is probably one of the best book on the founders and I highly recommend that book. Um there's a great book by Patrick. Again, I really like Patrick Henry. Uh there's a book that's called Patrick Henry. Um which was written by um [sighs] who's the the agrarian from Vandy? Um is it Edsil Thomas Edsil? I can't remember. I think there's only one biography about Patrick Henry.

1:10:47 Anyways, uh I want to say it's Thomas Edil. one of the van the Vanderbel agrarian uh political philosophers from the early 1900s. I just cannot remember the author but that's a great book too. Um yeah and nowadays too I I don't listen to them but I hear that there are a lot of good podcasts and stuff. Um I'm like woefully ignorant on you have to I'll defer to some other gentlemen who are more versed in media uh and things than myself. Thank y'all. Thank you.